Posts by Coded Logic

34

What do you think is the source of your consciousness? Can it be copied or transferred?

by EndofMysteries in

this seems to be a question that even scientifically is still in the air.

right now your consciousness, is it the physical part of the brain?

the electrical signals in the brain?

Coded Logic

It seems that this is more a discussion of theseus' paradox than it is anything to do with consciousness specifically.
-OEJ

Agreed! But is suppose it all depends upon definitions. If we're defining consciousness as our thoughts and feelings produced by our brain states - then yes, I would think it could one day be transferable. But if we're defining consciousness as our subjective first hand experience of the world we inhabit - then no it's not transferable.

Though I would argue that, under the second definition, every time we go to sleep at night our consciousness is lost forever and every time we wake up in the morning we're a different person.

However, I think it's a mistake to confuse consciousness with identity. Identity is transient. It's always in a state of flux. And what makes me "me" isn't any single conscious state. Rather, it's the sum totality of my aspirations and experiences and how I relate to myself and my environment and my loved ones and my community.

Perhaps one day we will be able to copy consciousness. But to copy consciousness isn't to copy identity.

83

Christadelphian

by Billy1000 in

my name is stephen and i am new to the forum.

i am a christadelphian and through my discussions with fellow members of my ecclesia it has inspired me to reach out to other religions to find out exactly what others believe to enhance my own faith and further bring me closer to our heavenly father.

in no way do i mean disrespect if it has been caused.

Coded Logic

What does your faith believe to be the blessings that were spoken of.
In particular the promises in the garden of Eden, Abraham and David

I believe that these are ancient myths from the Sumerians that were later hellenized by the Israelites around the third century BCE. There is not a shred of evidence that Abraham was a real person but there is a great deal of evidence that humanity did not start six thousand years ago in a garden of Eden.

To believe in a literal garden of Eden is deep roots of our homo-sapien heritage that goes back hundreds of thousands of years.

For example, here's the cave painting of Altamira. Using uranium-thorium dating we know it's around 20,000 years old:

58

Mind Body Dualism

by Coded Logic in

i've never found dualism - the idea that the mind and the brain are two different substances with the mind being "immaterial" or "non-material" - a valid manner in which to address consciousness or any mysteries relating to it.

to show the reasons why i think it's bad metaphysics i'll use analogous reasoning to make a case for my newly made up "mystic essence".. for hundreds of years scientists have studied plants and animals all across the world.

but they still can't explain where ecosystems come from.

Coded Logic

I too agree that consciousness is most likely a matter of degree. That is to say, the more processing power an organism has the more its potential for a higher level of consciousness. Animals that are highly sentient consistently have brains with large numbers of connections and high neuronal densities (octopods, dolphins, crows, elephants, etc).

Which is why I'd be really surprised if we ever found out plants were conscious. They have very few connections in their nervous system and even something like a large maple tree with it's vast array of solar collectors (leaves) only generates about 200 millivolts of energy for the entire organism. Whereas something like the human brain all by itself consumes 12 volts (12,000 millivolts) to say nothing of the power requirements for the rest of our metabolism necessary to keep our brains functioning.

If we ever do bump into an advanced alien civilization I think there are some predictions we can make. That they will have a predatory past (meat is the food source with the highest energy content), they will have highly articulate digits/antenna/arms/legs/tentacles/whatever (necessary for building and using tools), and will come from a high oxygen non-aquatic environment (access to fire is also necessary for tool building).

33

Can any believer make a case for the superiority of faith over knowledge?

by Half banana in

i find it curious why so many here on this site, in the face of factual evidence for things such as evolution and the impossibility for anyone to make a coherent interpretation for the bible, would still prefer faith to knowledge?.

can any believer attempt a defence of this position?.

Coded Logic

Faith is the product of a whole host of cognitive errors . . .

Conformation bias: Only acknowledging information that supports what you already believe while ignoring any and all information that's inconvenient or counter to your preconceptions.
Personal bias: Thinking that your positions are solid simply because you hold them or because such a position is necessary for you to maintain internal congruence.
Conclusions before evidence: Having a firmly staked out position without knowing any of the facts or principles necessary to arrive at a conclusion.
Intellectual dishonesty: Willfully failing to follow the evidence where it leads or failing to address any facts that would undermine your existing positions.
Availability error: Having your perceptions distorted by the human tendency to remember seemingly meaningful outcomes while forgetting outcomes you didn't realize were actually important.
Intellectual laziness: Preferring one conclusion over another purely because it's simpler for you to understand or because it doesn't require any research.

. . . just to name a few.

58

Mind Body Dualism

by Coded Logic in

i've never found dualism - the idea that the mind and the brain are two different substances with the mind being "immaterial" or "non-material" - a valid manner in which to address consciousness or any mysteries relating to it.

to show the reasons why i think it's bad metaphysics i'll use analogous reasoning to make a case for my newly made up "mystic essence".. for hundreds of years scientists have studied plants and animals all across the world.

but they still can't explain where ecosystems come from.

Coded Logic

Science uses metaphysics to form hypotheses and come up with ways to test them. In turn, we use scientific findings to inform our metaphysics.

met·a·phys·ics

ˌmedəˈfiziks/

noun

the branch of philosophy that deals with the first principles of things, including abstract concepts such as being, knowing, substance, cause, identity, time, and space.

58

Mind Body Dualism

by Coded Logic in

i've never found dualism - the idea that the mind and the brain are two different substances with the mind being "immaterial" or "non-material" - a valid manner in which to address consciousness or any mysteries relating to it.

to show the reasons why i think it's bad metaphysics i'll use analogous reasoning to make a case for my newly made up "mystic essence".. for hundreds of years scientists have studied plants and animals all across the world.

but they still can't explain where ecosystems come from.

Coded Logic

If our brains are just "receivers" picking up consciousness from somewhere else - is there anyway we could ever verify or falsify such a hypothesis?

http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/topic/288811/science-stoppers

58

Mind Body Dualism

by Coded Logic in

i've never found dualism - the idea that the mind and the brain are two different substances with the mind being "immaterial" or "non-material" - a valid manner in which to address consciousness or any mysteries relating to it.

to show the reasons why i think it's bad metaphysics i'll use analogous reasoning to make a case for my newly made up "mystic essence".. for hundreds of years scientists have studied plants and animals all across the world.

but they still can't explain where ecosystems come from.

Coded Logic

no matter how you slice it, we will never know how consciousness exists. Oh we may say it originates here or there. But how? We will never know.

No offense TL, but I think you're claiming to know things you can't possibly know. The diverse speciation on our planet was also once hailed as an insoluble mystery. But despite such cynicism Darwin did the hard work and spent half a lifetime doing field research looking for an answer. And do you know what happened?

. . . He developed the scientific theory of evolution that is now the backbone of modern biology. I think his words, as someone who knew first hand, carry a lot of wait on the topic:

Saying that we can't know the answer to something is perhaps the most closed minded position a person can ever have. I would sincerely encourage you to be a little more open minded on the topic.

5

A novel preaching method

by Listener in

i came across this novel way of preaching on facebook.

probably one of the easier ways to get your hours in.. https://www.facebook.com/jwbrothers.org/videos/538251706351890/.

Coded Logic

Okay, so I gotta give credit where credit is due (even if it's painful and I have to grind my teeth while doing it - lol). At least they are trying to engage their community and not just stand there doing nothing. And I feel this is a reasonably positive manner in which to do it.

Great piano player too!

58

Mind Body Dualism

by Coded Logic in

i've never found dualism - the idea that the mind and the brain are two different substances with the mind being "immaterial" or "non-material" - a valid manner in which to address consciousness or any mysteries relating to it.

to show the reasons why i think it's bad metaphysics i'll use analogous reasoning to make a case for my newly made up "mystic essence".. for hundreds of years scientists have studied plants and animals all across the world.

but they still can't explain where ecosystems come from.

Coded Logic

Coded, maps and territories are physical. A thought is not physical.
-SBF

Clearly we have reached opposite conclusions on this. I think thoughts are physical while you think they are not physical. Let's see if we can find out exactly where our differences lie and why.

I suppose a good start would be to ask you do you think the electrochemical reactions in our brains influence our thoughts? And do you think that, when we change the chemistry in the brain, it changes how we think (e.g. drinking coffee, alcohol, hallucinogens, etc).

Also, would you categorize the simulations run on my X-box as immaterial?

58

Mind Body Dualism

by Coded Logic in

i've never found dualism - the idea that the mind and the brain are two different substances with the mind being "immaterial" or "non-material" - a valid manner in which to address consciousness or any mysteries relating to it.

to show the reasons why i think it's bad metaphysics i'll use analogous reasoning to make a case for my newly made up "mystic essence".. for hundreds of years scientists have studied plants and animals all across the world.

but they still can't explain where ecosystems come from.

Coded Logic

Coded I think one of the problems with viewing ideas and other non-material things as epiphenomenal (or emergent properties) is that it gives priority to matter in a way that is unjustified and still amounts to reductionism.
-SBF

I'm afraid I don't quite follow what you're objection is here. When I'm talking about emergent properties I mean physical aspects emerging from physical systems. I don't see that as giving priority to matter in an unjustified way.

When I play video games on my X-box it runs extremely complex simulations. But I don't think that my X-box is somehow transcending physical reality. Rather, it's using its physical components to produce an emergent physical system. I feel the same is true of our thoughts and our feelings. They are very much grounded in the physical laws of reality and its material process'.

As the saying goes, the map is not the territory. Rather, it's a representation of the territory. But nobody would say maps are "immaterial". Likewise our thoughts are not the thing we are thinking about (unicorns, space ships, winning lottery tickets). But it doesn't mean thoughts are immaterial.